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Post by AlanIsMauriceSett on Sept 18, 2011 18:49:22 GMT
We have the players now but it's square pegs in round holes again. Imagine a midfield of Wilson and Palacios: bite, conviction AND composure. And ffs let's see Shotton at right back now and reinstate Huth in the middle because his Titanic-like turns are sure as hell going to be exposed by Man U! The other big worry for me is Crouch. I mean, at that price he's going to get starts but for me he's simply not mobile enough to fit the role.  |
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Post by Donkey on Sept 18, 2011 18:53:53 GMT
Wilko at left back, Shotton at right back, Huth and Shawcross in the middle. Wilson and Palacios in centre midfield?
Could that work?
No worries about Crouch, he's only just joined.
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Post by AlanIsMauriceSett on Sept 18, 2011 18:58:51 GMT
Sounds good to me mate. I know Crouchy just joined and we have to give him time but it's the nature of the beast that bothers me.
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Post by Donkey on Sept 18, 2011 19:01:29 GMT
He'll come good, once the team decides to attack for once instead of going out to defend.
He's like Kenny, some good games and some bad. And once he gets a decent midfield behind him (Palacios - Wilson/Whelan) he'll be fine.
Pulis knows better than to waste 10 million quid on Eidur Gudjohnson mk 2.
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Post by SamTheLost on Sept 18, 2011 19:07:47 GMT
Wilko at lb...  |
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Post by Donkey on Sept 18, 2011 19:21:36 GMT
Wilko at lb... Just as a test, he played well against Kiev at left back. For the majority of the game at least. |
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Post by SamTheLost on Sept 18, 2011 19:23:21 GMT
Well? I love Wilko as a player but he had no fucking idea what he was doing against Kiev, he's terrible on the left and constantly gets lost positioning wise.
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Post by PenkhullStokie on Sept 18, 2011 19:26:52 GMT
Higgy is back in 3 weeks. Wilko/Shotton - Huth/Woodgate - Shawcross/Upson - Higgy/Wilson
Pennant/Soares - Palacios/Delap - Whelan/Whitehead - Etherington/Tonge(?!)
Crouch/Jones/Walters/Jerome Rotate between them. Huth to never be played at RB. Delap never at RM. Diao not on the pitch. |
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Post by Donkey on Sept 18, 2011 19:31:04 GMT
If Higgy is back in 3 weeks then we can last until then with Wilson at left back and Whelan in central midfield with Palacios.
The only problem is whether Higgy will be good enough. Long injury + age = probably not very quick anymore. Hope I'm wrong but in the next window a left back along with wing back-up is needed.
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Post by Humphrey Syphon on Sept 18, 2011 19:38:39 GMT
Today was just a bad day all round, it happens and doesnt concern me too much. Nothing worked for us, everything fell for them, thats football. Away games always feature TP`s defensive tactics and we rarely attack anyone so Crouch wont get a lot of balls to attack. Our home games to date have been exercises in preventing the opposition scoring, as will be the case against Man U, again Crouch will have limited chances. We will see Crouch doing his job in home games against Blackburn,Fulham, Bolton,Wolves etc when our wingers will be allowed to get forward more and provide the crosses into the box. We`ll be ok, the goals will come and we`ll be fine  |
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Post by MermaidSal on Sept 18, 2011 20:08:05 GMT
If Higgy is back in 3 weeks then we can last until then with Wilson at left back and Whelan in central midfield with Palacios. The only problem is whether Higgy will be good enough. Long injury + age = probably not very quick anymore. Hope I'm wrong but in the next window a left back along with wing back-up is needed. Hmm, we were saying that last year and he proved everyone wrong but with his injury history you'd have to guess he's into his last couple of seasons now. Remember how much more solid we suddenly got last time he was in the side regularly though so I'm crossing fingers hard. As for composure I'm puzzling it over, ok bossing a game and getting majority possession is rare for us but in general, two blocks of four and build from the back's been making us seem VERY composed for a fair while now, especially with two fit wingers. I'm wanting to believe this is our annual conniption as new players bed in... but I definitely think we'll be stronger with two real FBs, that really is Tone's Achilles heel |
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Post by SuperRickyFuller on Sept 18, 2011 20:23:54 GMT
The centre of midfield was nothing short of invisible today. The only time I saw Delap was when we had a throw in. As much as I've stood by the bloke thanks to his reading of the game, it's time we started phasing him out. We've got a quality midfielder in Palacios right there and he came on way too late today, about 60 minutes too late
It's nothing short of criminal playing a midfield of Whitehead and Delap because it's negative, slow, crap. Even through the back end of last season, the best centre midfield pairing was Delap and Whelan. At least then Delap could do the dirty work and Whelan work the ball either to the back four or out wide. We just don't have that with a pairing of Whitehead and Delap
Get Palacios and Whelan in the middle, Huth back at CB, Shotton at RB, Wilko at LB (Higgy at LB once he's back) and go back to Jones and Walters up front. Go back to basics, back to balance, back to sense. Today was a disgrace, I'm still fucking raging at that surrender. There was no level of performance, it was just a surrender, no effort, fight, battle. That isn't Stoke City
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Post by Donkey on Sept 18, 2011 20:30:46 GMT
The centre of midfield was nothing short of invisible today. The only time I saw Delap was when we had a throw in. As much as I've stood by the bloke thanks to his reading of the game, it's time we started phasing him out. We've got a quality midfielder in Palacios right there and he came on way too late today, about 60 minutes too late It's nothing short of criminal playing a midfield of Whitehead and Delap because it's negative, slow, crap. Even through the back end of last season, the best centre midfield pairing was Delap and Whelan. At least then Delap could do the dirty work and Whelan work the ball either to the back four or out wide. We just don't have that with a pairing of Whitehead and Delap Get Palacios and Whelan in the middle, Huth back at CB, Shotton at RB, Wilko at LB (Higgy at LB once he's back) and go back to Jones and Walters up front. Go back to basics, back to balance, back to sense. Today was a disgrace, I'm still fucking raging at that surrender. There was no level of performance, it was just a surrender, no effort, fight, battle. That isn't Stoke City  |
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Post by Pretty Little Boother on Sept 18, 2011 22:16:23 GMT
This is why the window was a disappointment in some aspects. To me it's blindingly obvious that or CM is the worst in the division, I genuinely think there are top half Championship teams with better all-round CMs than Delap and Whitehead. We needed two in, not one, and we only needed one CB, not two. I know Woodgate and Upson were freebies but having them is proving too much of a headache for TP who's too scared not to play Woodgate or Huth. Woodgate's looked class on occasion but not worth breaking up the Huth/Shawcross partnership, and especially not breaking it up to also make us look wank at RB, which is making Pennant's game suffer too.
The resources would have been far better spent in looking to bring in another CM and getting rid of Whitehead if necessary.
I'd have loved Barton but we got outmuscled spectacularly, I'd have loved Parker but there was no chance, and I'd have loved Kranjcar but fully appreciate he'd more than likely have been an utter flop. But off the top of my head I can think of at least four CMs who'd have improved us, who we really could have got if we put or minds to it; David Vaughan, Mark Noble, Jack Collison, Kevin Nolan. All of those graft away and do everything that TP demands, but just have that extra bit of composure and quality that Delap and Whitehead simply don't possess.
I fucking love Glenn Whelan, when he's good he looks great for us, but hen he's bad he is fucking terrible. I just really honestly hope that TP's plan is to wait until Higgy's back before moving Wilson next to Palacios.
Still doesn't solve the right-back situation though. I think TP should man fucking up and drop Woodgate. He still has a massive part to play but having Huth at RB is really detrimental to Pennant, and with that, a huge chunk of our attacking threat.
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Post by Bojantastic on Sept 18, 2011 22:28:37 GMT
Next week Palacios and Whelan should start in the middle. Crouch and Jerome I'd start again because I thought they had potential today, the problem was the midfield. I'd also drop Ethers because he's been poor this season and I don't think his fitness is quite right yet, so I'd play Walters on one wing and Pennant on the other. I'd then put Shotton right back, Wilko left back (Wilson was fucking awful today) then I'd have Upson in with Shawcross. Judging on recent performances, our best XI is: Begovic Shotton Shawcross Upson Wilkinson Pennant Palacios Whelan Walters Crouch Jerome  |
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Post by Pretty Little Boother on Sept 18, 2011 22:33:41 GMT
In the absence of a winger I'd like to have a look at Jerome on one flank rather than Walters. I'm not sure whether Jerome can cross, but neither can Walters, and I'd rather have Jerome's pace with the ball and maybe even cutting in and having a shot rather than Walters not really even doing that. Love Walters as a striker, in fact in a Fuller-less side he's probably my favourite striker, but he's pretty wank out wide.
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Post by Donkey on Sept 18, 2011 22:36:40 GMT
Why is he pretty wank out wide, he won player of the year at Ipswich playing right mid didn't he?
Having said that, both Davies and Collins won player of the year the season before signing for Stoke.
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Post by Pretty Little Boother on Sept 18, 2011 22:38:17 GMT
Yeah in the Championship, and Tricky Dicky Cresswell scored twelve goals from the left in our promotion season.
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Post by Dharma Bum on Sept 18, 2011 23:25:40 GMT
Why is he pretty wank out wide, he won player of the year at Ipswich playing right mid didn't he? Having said that, both Davies and Collins won player of the year the season before signing for Stoke. It's a waste of Walters' strength to play him out wide imo. Even if Jerome is wank at crossing he'll stretch defences more effctively with his pace. |
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Post by irbaboon on Sept 19, 2011 9:46:58 GMT
I did say previously you play the way we do then you take that gamble, simple.
If your players do not turn up given TP's love for absorbing pressure inevitably you will get a tonking.
The more players TP get in with supposed better quality the more he seems to think we can absorb more pressure ;D
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