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Post by PenkhullStokie on Jun 15, 2011 21:56:15 GMT
I'll try not to mention him too much by the way  So what players can/will be pivotal for us in the future. From our current squad, there's only a few. Future stars:Begovic. Huth. Shawcross. Wilson. Marshall. Cuvelier. Shotton.
Have a future:Wilko. Pennant. Etherington. Whelan. Jones. Walters.
Injury stricken:Fuller. Sidibe. Higginbotham Nearing the end:Diao. Delap. FayeThen there's the squad fillers. Davies, Pugh, Soare and Tonge. And the ones I'm unsure about. Moult/Lund not seen enough. Whitehead I don't know, he's behind Whelan.Rory and any other new CM we sign, would like him to stay. Anyway, after that, there's only Begovic, Huth, Shawcross and Wilson who are certain for the future. Where Wilson will play I don't know, Pulis banged on about him being a great center mid, but he needs to be quicker on the ball. For now Wilson/Wilko/Shotton will do for RB. Begovic
Wilko - Huth - Shawcross - ? ? ? ? ?
Pennant - ? ? ? ? ? - ? ? ? ? ? - Etherington
Jones - Walters/?? ??
Sorensen/?? ??, Shotton, Wilson, ?? ??/Walters, Whelan, ?? ?? We need younger players, Obinna, Jerome, El-Arabi, Noble and not experienced pensioners like Bellamy, Cetin, Poulsen and Carew. Banged on a bit, but got my point across. ;D |
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Post by Donkey on Jun 15, 2011 21:59:19 GMT
Wouldn't say Whelan has much of a future, he'd been linked with Wolves but that isn't the main threat. The minute we get an attacking midfielder (and we've been linked with many) he will be on the bench and eventually sold. Pulis quite rightly likes one attacking midfielder and one semi-defensive.
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Post by PenkhullStokie on Jun 15, 2011 22:05:08 GMT
Wouldn't say Whelan has much of a future, he'd been linked with Wolves but that isn't the main threat. The minute we get an attacking midfielder (and we've been linked with many) he will be on the bench and eventually sold. Pulis quite rightly likes one attacking midfielder and one semi-defensive. Agree with that, but I still think if we signed one, he'd stick around for the next season anyway, he'll still get games in cups, bench and through injury/suspension. Europe and everything. Noble would be my upgrade on Whelan, with ReoCoker or Vaughan upgrading from Whitehead/Rory. Maybe Barton and Palacios if we're being optimistic. ;D |
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Post by SuperRickyFuller on Jun 15, 2011 22:08:02 GMT
I think remaining in the Premier League, slowly improving the squad on a whole and upgrading aging players as time goes on are all vital, especially if you're looking ten years down the line. We really do need a new Academy Director, someone with real know how. I'd love to see us go for whoever is running Southamptons Academy and someone who'd really push TP in saying "look, this lad is a talent and worth a go, even if it's in a cup game"
Going further from that, hopefully we can become self-sufficient and be able to have at least 40% of the squad come from the Academy. We've got the facilities, we're in the right league and we've got the money. What we don't have is an extensive scouting network (however, that's definitely improving considering the 14 year old Aussie keeper we've signed), a man with the know how to drive it forward in the right way or a manager who's willing to at least give them five or ten minutes here and there
That brings me onto another unrelated point though. I do trust TP to make the right call when it comes to players being good enough for the first team and there's surely a reason why we released all the second years, mainly that none of them (arguably) were good enough. Take Dave Parton for example, would he really have ousted Bego and Sorro within the next five years? I'd bet my balls on it that he wouldn't. However, we've got two lads there, Shotton and Cuvelier, who're genuine talents who really do deserve a bit of game time, especially Shotton. Marshall seems a tricky little player, in the same mould as our Matty Etherington from what I've seen and heard
The future in a nutshell then? Replace aging players with like for like replacements or upgrades, improve squad competition and depth with a blend of proven talent and young talent, get the Academy sorted by appointing a proper Director with a proven track record to oversee everything and see a side within 15-20 years full of proper Stoke fans
I'm probably dreaming but it's certainly possible if you have the right people in the right places with the right knowledge
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Post by Roy Cropper on Jun 15, 2011 22:13:26 GMT
Agree there SRF, I think Coates see's the academy as the future from hearing his quotes about making the club self-sustainable and for me the way to do it is to get in a top academy director. I thought we were sorted when we signed the bloke from Crewe (the one who fucked off to Chelsea, forgotten his name).
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Post by SamTheLost on Jun 15, 2011 22:16:31 GMT
Steve Holland wasn't it who went off to Chelsea?
We're clearly trying to expand both the academy and the scouting network (2 attempts, and well publicised attempts, at signing 2 top player from abroad).
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Post by SuperRickyFuller on Jun 15, 2011 22:16:32 GMT
Agree there SRF, I think Coates see's the academy as the future from hearing his quotes about making the club self-sustainable and for me the way to do it is to get in a top academy director. I thought we were sorted when we signed the bloke from Crewe (the one who fucked off to Chelsea, forgotten his name). Steve Holland Apparently, the Academy was really heading in a very promising direction when he took over. He's a fantastic coach, shit manager though |
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Post by Bayernoatcake on Jun 15, 2011 22:16:33 GMT
Coates does see the future in the academy but Pulis doesn't give a shit about it as he has shown throughout his time here. Something needs to change regarding it, I get the feeling that Coates lets TP not give a shit because of what else he has done and turns blind eye. Or he hasn't got a clue what is happening there and how badly ran it is and how TP doesn't give a shit. It's sad really. But that's our future right there being wasted.
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Post by PenkhullStokie on Jun 15, 2011 22:17:30 GMT
What Ajax do is employ ex-players/legends to work with the academy.
They're trying to get Van der Sar to become GK coach, they have Jaap Stam, Bergkamp etc all coaching in the youth teams.
Why couldn't we have Rory, Nash, Hoekstra, and others coaching? Would we do it?
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Post by SuperRickyFuller on Jun 15, 2011 22:19:40 GMT
What Ajax do is employ ex-players/legends to work with the academy. They're trying to get Van der Sar to become GK coach, they have Jaap Stam, Bergkamp etc all coaching in the youth teams. Why couldn't we have Rory, Nash, Hoekstra, and others coaching? Would we do it? I'd love to see Hoekstra as our Academy Director. He'd obviously need a bit of help at first with the day to day admin stuff but the philosophy would change at a base level and see us, hopefully, churning out technically gifted players |
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Post by Bayernoatcake on Jun 15, 2011 22:23:39 GMT
Hoekstra is working in Holland where they actually give a shit, I would love it to but it isn't going to happen! It must be soul destroying working in the academy under TP, let's be honest.
He could produce as many technically gifted players too but why? TP doesn't trust youth and bar in certain areas (2wingers and a striker) there is no need for being technically gifted.
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Post by PenkhullStokie on Jun 15, 2011 22:31:03 GMT
Hoekstra is working in Holland where they actually give a shit, I would love it to but it isn't going to happen! It must be soul destroying working in the academy under TP, let's be honest. He could produce as many technically gifted players too but why? TP doesn't trust youth and bar in certain areas (2wingers and a striker) there is no need for being technically gifted. Take the CB situation for example. On trial, 2 center backs. I watched both. First one (Parry) - Tonk, built like a tank, 6ft+, fucking useless, donkey. We signed him. Second one (Abisade) - Decent on the ball, played a great through ball for the left winger to run onto, was a bit small, so was outjumped a few by the frog like Tunji. But he's 15, he'll grow. He wasn't signed, told he was too small. Pulis/the academy just look for the athletes and try and mould them into footballers. Flo is the other way around, TP is trying beef him up. ;D |
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Post by Bayernoatcake on Jun 15, 2011 22:39:09 GMT
Did they both in that Sunderland game? If so both were garbage! I know Parry did, he was just a big useless lump. But he looks likes TP defender at the least and maybe he can be moulded into something decent. But going off that game I won't hold my breath.
The academy is a joke, we have a manager that doesn't give a shit, it hasn't got an overall leader, we have a chairman who doesn't see the problem or turns a blind eye to it and it's just a joke. What pisses me of the most is how few local lads are in there.
The only way it will be sorted is if Coates goes over TP's head or when TP leaves.
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Post by PenkhullStokie on Jun 15, 2011 22:43:50 GMT
Naah Abisade went on a trial day where they had a load of trialists over, but he text me when he got there saying they're playing a game, so I watched, was just a friendly between themselves.
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Post by PenkhullStokie on Jun 15, 2011 22:45:05 GMT
Did they both in that Sunderland game? If so both were garbage! I know Parry did, he was just a big useless lump. But he looks likes TP defender at the least and maybe he can be moulded into something decent. But going off that game I won't hold my breath. The academy is a joke, we have a manager that doesn't give a shit, it hasn't got an overall leader, we have a chairman who doesn't see the problem or turns a blind eye to it and it's just a joke. What pisses me of the most is how few local lads are in there. The only way it will be sorted is if Coates goes over TP's head or when TP leaves. Even if we get relegated, TP won't leave, but I think Coates will get pissed off if his good money invested in the academy doesn't come to good use, which it won't. |
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Post by SuperRickyFuller on Jun 15, 2011 22:47:07 GMT
Parry sounds a bit like Paul Williams
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Post by Bayernoatcake on Jun 15, 2011 22:51:47 GMT
Did they both in that Sunderland game? If so both were garbage! I know Parry did, he was just a big useless lump. But he looks likes TP defender at the least and maybe he can be moulded into something decent. But going off that game I won't hold my breath. The academy is a joke, we have a manager that doesn't give a shit, it hasn't got an overall leader, we have a chairman who doesn't see the problem or turns a blind eye to it and it's just a joke. What pisses me of the most is how few local lads are in there. The only way it will be sorted is if Coates goes over TP's head or when TP leaves. Even if we get relegated, TP won't leave, but I think Coates will get pissed off if his good money invested in the academy doesn't come to good use, which it won't. He will leave one day though! And the bloke who takes over will do so with a shite academy to look forward to! It's just short-sighted. Coates should, I got told we paid a million quid for the Swede but how long will it take for him not to be played, 3/4 years? It'll be too late by then. It looks like we're in a proper reserve league (not the Premier League one) though this year which is a start! But TP just doesn't trust youth, look at Shotton! |
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Post by SamTheLost on Jun 15, 2011 22:53:24 GMT
So was the academy still a joke/being ignored when we had one of the best academy chiefs in England running it (who was poached from us by Chelsea)...?
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Post by Donkey on Jun 15, 2011 22:57:14 GMT
Even if we get relegated, TP won't leave, but I think Coates will get pissed off if his good money invested in the academy doesn't come to good use, which it won't. He will leave one day though! And the bloke who takes over will do so with a shite academy to look forward to! It's just short-sighted. Coates should, I got told we paid a million quid for the Swede but how long will it take for him not to be played, 3/4 years? It'll be too late by then. It looks like we're in a proper reserve league (not the Premier League one) though this year which is a start! But TP just doesn't trust youth, look at Shotton! Shotton is slowly getting there, a few appearances including the one against Blackpool (short though it was) show this. It is hard for him that he's competing with Wilkinson for a place, who is a player who's been with us for a while, a very good player and a fans favourite. Next season will be the year to judge a few academy players and Shotton with all the extra games that we will hopefully see them in. |
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Post by Bayernoatcake on Jun 15, 2011 22:57:42 GMT
So was the academy still a joke/being ignored when we had one of the best academy chiefs in England running it (who was poached from us by Chelsea)...? It's hard to say with any conviction because he was here for such a short time! But TP has ignored the academy throughout his time here so it's not too far from the realms of believability that he did. Holland looked like he was doing good things but since he left it's gone tits up. We employed a Academy Director who wasn't qualified for the job and now we don't have one. It's a joke. The only thing it harms is Stoke long term hence why TP doesn't give a shit. |
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