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Post by MermaidSal on Nov 2, 2012 13:39:08 GMT
Salop don't worry, my red poppy is safely pinned on....
But the clue is in the title, I still hate, really increasingly and strongly hate, the way Remembrance Day is being stolen by the media (not the servicemen/women themselves) to celebrate serving soldiers in Afghanistan and elsewhere.
Sorry but that's not what it's for. I and many thousands more pay respect on 11.11 to the men of several generations ago now who were forced, by manipulated patriotism or conscription, into being murdered by politicians and generals in World War 1. And in a more honourable cause in World War 2. I'm equally paying respect to the German soldiers who were forced into the same corrupted sacrifice, and the troops from many other countries who found themselves part of wars which were little to do with them.
But citizen soldiers is the point. We don't have citizen soldiers now, we have peacetime volunteers/career soldiers, it's a completely different deal. And I hate, really hate and despise people who steal that past for the wrong reasons and to make political capital in the present.
WE NEED A VETERANS DAY. Nothing to do with Armistice, or poppies, and it should celebrate the blue light emergency services too. I'm so not saying we shouldn't give presently serving guys the respect due. It's just time to stop tangling that up with Armistice Day. That takes away from the people in the present too, which is all wrong.
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Post by overthewall on Nov 2, 2012 13:44:47 GMT
We are building up to the day when it comes out that the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq have been a complete waste of life, money and time. That will probably last for a couple of days before we have a pop at somewhere else !!
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Post by JonesInAMillion on Nov 2, 2012 13:58:16 GMT
Wearing mine in memory, respect and thanks to all fallen servicemen (& women), but in particular WW1 & WW2. Can we get one on the banner for the next week or so?  |
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Post by jamlander on Nov 2, 2012 13:59:26 GMT
What you reading at the moment Sal?  |
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Post by Bojantastic on Nov 2, 2012 14:11:48 GMT
I completely get your point Sal, but as OnTheWall said, the two recent wars will probably viewed how Vietnam is now, in the future.
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Post by SuperRickyFuller on Nov 2, 2012 14:26:28 GMT
Wearing mine in memory, respect and thanks to all fallen servicemen (& women), but in particular WW1 & WW2. Can we get one on the banner for the next week or so? I mentioned plonking it on the banners on the improvements thread |
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Post by Donkey on Nov 2, 2012 14:28:17 GMT
Already have done you observant bastards.
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Post by SuperRickyFuller on Nov 2, 2012 14:28:40 GMT
Triffic
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Post by JonesInAMillion on Nov 2, 2012 15:01:07 GMT
Already have done you observant bastards. Its only on the main page; my favorites are set sraight to the RWL so I'll never see it  FFSD |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2012 16:58:01 GMT
I completely get your point Sal, but as OnTheWall said, the two recent wars will probably viewed how Vietnam is now, in the future. Probably, but it doesn't stop you seeing that Afghanistan is going to go tribal/Taliban crazy as soon as the West leaves. In other words, 10 years' waste of money and life for no reason at all. |
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Post by SuperRickyFuller on Nov 2, 2012 17:07:41 GMT
I completely get your point Sal, but as OnTheWall said, the two recent wars will probably viewed how Vietnam is now, in the future. Probably, but it doesn't stop you seeing that Afghanistan is going to go tribal/Taliban crazy as soon as the West leaves. In other words, 10 years' waste of money and life for no reason at all. It'll be another ten years if Romney gets in, the absolute fucking fruitloop |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2012 17:12:25 GMT
He won't, dunna fret.
Hurricane Sandy's done her bit for non-mental people of the planet.
When push comes to shove and it's time to create a hanging chad with their sausage like bloated fingers, bin Laden and the hurricane is all that the loons will remember!
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Post by Salopstick on Nov 2, 2012 17:15:54 GMT
Salop don't worry, my red poppy is safely pinned on.... But the clue is in the title, I still hate, really increasingly and strongly hate, the way Remembrance Day is being stolen by the media (not the servicemen/women themselves) to celebrate serving soldiers in Afghanistan and elsewhere. Sorry but that's not what it's for. I and many thousands more pay respect on 11.11 to the men of several generations ago now who were forced, by manipulated patriotism or conscription, into being murdered by politicians and generals in World War 1. And in a more honourable cause in World War 2. I'm equally paying respect to the German soldiers who were forced into the same corrupted sacrifice, and the troops from many other countries who found themselves part of wars which were little to do with them. But citizen soldiers is the point. We don't have citizen soldiers now, we have peacetime volunteers/career soldiers, it's a completely different deal. And I hate, really hate and despise people who steal that past for the wrong reasons and to make political capital in the present. WE NEED A VETERANS DAY. Nothing to do with Armistice, or poppies, and it should celebrate the blue light emergency services too. I'm so not saying we shouldn't give presently serving guys the respect due. It's just time to stop tangling that up with Armistice Day. That takes away from the people in the present too, which is all wrong. Stick to the white one sal, you wouldn't want to contribute to the British legion who help every ex forces regardless of age and when served. Unlike HFH |
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Post by The Funkasaurus on Nov 2, 2012 20:07:47 GMT
I think it's a dangerous game picking and choosing which wars are worthy of remembering/supporting. Whatever your own political view or stance on our involvement in any wars/conflicts, on 11.11 it is the fallen servicemen we are remembering and helping to support through the buying of Poppy's, surely it shouldn't matter when or in what war and whether they were forced to sign up or have chosen that path, they have still given their lives and their families still need that support now, just like they did in WW1 & WW2.
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Post by unclefestersstrawb on Nov 2, 2012 20:15:29 GMT
I hate to say it but, i think mumf sums it up perfectly for me over yonder .......except for his insults  |
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Post by The Funkasaurus on Nov 2, 2012 20:32:29 GMT
Sal - In what way do you see present servicemen inAfghanistan 'celebrated?' Is it not just admiration for a hugely difficult and dangerous job, not a celebration of the war itself?
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Post by Salopstick on Nov 2, 2012 20:42:50 GMT
She's in hiding
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Post by MermaidSal on Nov 2, 2012 21:13:39 GMT
I think it's a dangerous game picking and choosing which wars are worthy of remembering/supporting. Whatever your own political view or stance on our involvement in any wars/conflicts, on 11.11 it is the fallen servicemen we are remembering and helping to support through the buying of Poppy's, surely it shouldn't matter when or in what war and whether they were forced to sign up or have chosen that path, they have still given their lives and their families still need that support now, just like they did in WW1 & WW2. But that's just what I was trying to say - it's about remembering the fallen. |
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Post by MermaidSal on Nov 2, 2012 21:17:35 GMT
Sal - In what way do you see present servicemen inAfghanistan 'celebrated?' Is it not just admiration for a hugely difficult and dangerous job, not a celebration of the war itself? Well the last two years at least, BBC and other coverage of 11.11 has given a good lot of time to people currently serving in Afghanistan, in ways I believe glorify that war and war in general. If they were concentrating on the work the Legion does for injured and other ex-soldiers from current conflicts, great. I totally applaud that and hope it gets shown more. Yes it's a difficult and dangerous job but personally I don't think it deserves any more or less respect than, say, a firefighter or a police officer or anyone else risking their life in a public service. |
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Post by Salopstick on Nov 2, 2012 21:23:50 GMT
They don't glorify the war they just bring to our attention the guys out there doing it at this time of the year. Because as well as remembering the past we should also think of the present. If you think it glorifies war you are very much misguided.
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